All:
The waiver was instituted after a year of consideration by the CYC board. The action was taken as a result of advice given to the board by the club Judge Advocate, Michael Goldfarb. In fact Michael recommended a piece of paper physically signed by the skipper and we opted for the electronic version. The issue is currently a topic of debate in an extensive email thread among the board members.
At present no one has been turned away from the starting line.
Newell is correct that waivers are pretty standard at any sporting event. In fact CYC was the only place I've raced in the last five years that didn't require one. Every junior regatta has a waiver and juniors do race on weeknights and at our regattas. Octoberfest has had a waiver for as long as I know.
For a long time we have felt that the RRS covered the club and RC by stating that the decision to race is the skipper's responsibility. Michael's advice on getting a signature or acknowledgement from the skipper is based on his belief that this is a statement on that particular individual's part that they understand the rules and liability under which they participate.
To Day's point this really is not a safety issue, it's a legal issue. Although Day's safety points below are worthy of note and perhaps a different thread of discussion.
So, that's why the board voted to have a waiver. But as I said it's
still being debated. The board is here to do the members' will and to
protect the members' interest. I'm all ears. I'll pose one consideration
-
One day, someone will die in a CYC race. It will likely be one of our dearest sailing friends. An angry family will sue us. How do we as a club prepare for that event so that in the end the club can continue?
Jim Lyle
jim@lyle.com
(206) 979-0809
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com
[mailto:owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com] On Behalf Of H.D.Chapin
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2003 10:01 AM
To: Newell D. Smith; MASeelig@msn.com; MJohns77@aol.com;
seattle-laser@sailpix.com
Cc: Corinthian Yacht Club
Subject: RE: Seattle Laser Sailing Reminder & safety
Marty, Newell, Mike, Fleet,
Good discussion. Is the issue legal, or safety or both? Is the question
- what can we do to make racing safer for all (especially new members)?,
or what legal words can be crafted to absolve responsibility?
For example. One of my concerns on the race course are those big keel boats with the pointy bows!, e.g. why are keel boats on the same course as center-board boats with a lot of new skippers on the course? Just two weeks ago a large boat (racing under CYC) charged through the Laser starting line at full speed - which many of us thought was very unsafe. Luckily no one was hit or hurt. I don't think any release should absolve the race committee, fleets, and CYC from thinking about safety and doing all they can to reduce the risk for all sailors.
It would be great if the more experienced sailors and club members could work with CYC, fleets, and the race committee to make the race course a safer environment - that would attract new sailors, lower the risks, and show that the community regards safety as an important issue which should be in everyone's interest.
-Day
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com
[mailto:owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com]On Behalf Of Newell D. Smith
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2003 9:28 AM
To: MASeelig@msn.com; MJohns77@aol.com; seattle-laser@sailpix.com
Cc: Corinthian Yacht Club
Subject: RE: Seattle Laser Sailing Reminder
Marty and all
The waiver can't excuse gross negligence, recklessness or intentional acts. This means you would be covered if Corinthian did something really stupid or worse. Most any sporting event will make you waive ordinary negligence. It is on the back of your ski lift ticket. Newell
Newell D. Smith
Mikkelborg, Broz, Wells & Fryer, PLLC
Phone: 206-623-5890
Fax: 206-623-0965
newellsmith@mbwf.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Seelig [mailto:MASeelig@email.msn.com]
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2003 11:28 PM
To: MJohns77@aol.com; seattle-laser@SailPix.com
Cc: 'Corinthian Yacht Club'
Subject: RE: Seattle Laser Sailing Reminder
Dear Mike,
I believe that the waiver is not in the best interests of either us sailors or CYC. In any event, it cannot be in both the best interests of us sailors and CYC too. Since we sailors are CYC, why are we doing this to ourselves? For my part I don't intend to race until I am able to get the waiver changed, and I would recommend that other sailors do the same. What the implications of the language are is not clear to me. If a sailor waives to the fullest extent permitted by law any and all claims you may have against CYC, what are the consequences to you if you are injured? Why would I as a fellow sailor and friend ask you to waive your rights? How will this benefit me as a member at your expense, and if it did, why should I ask you to do this for me? This waiver was hastily passed at a Board meeting in November or December 2002 with very little deliberation.
For my part I would recommend that anyone who has not already signed to not sign and that anyone who has done so rescind his waiver. Although my time is very limited to mess around with this stuff, my intention is to get this topic on the agenda at the next Board meeting. Preferably, I would like to get a special meeting of the Club to debate the issue. I plan to start working on that too.
Marty Seelig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com
[mailto:owner-seattle-laser@sailpix.com]On Behalf Of MJohns77@aol.com
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2003 12:09 PM
To: seattle-laser@SailPix.com
Cc: Corinthian Yacht Club
Subject: Seattle Laser Sailing Reminder
Seattle Laser Sailors,
If you are sailing at CYC on Thursday evenings or on the weekends it is important that you have acknowledged / signed a liability waiver/release. Please see the text at the bottom of this email. If you signed up for a race package, or an individual event using the CYC webpage, this waiver was part of the registration. If you pay-as-you-go, then you may need to check with the CYC office to ensure they have a waiver on file for you. I checked with the CYC office and everyone on a season package has successfully completed the waiver.
Mike Johnson
161978
WAIVER / RELEASE For and in consideration of the acceptance by the Corinthian Yacht Club of Seattle of my entry in this regatta, I/We hereby accept all the risks and responsibilities of my yacht's participation in said regatta and agree to release, hold harmless, and waive to the fullest extent permitted by law any and all claims I may have against the Corinthian Yacht Club of Seattle, its members, officers, directors, committees, agents and/or employees arising out of or in any way connected with such participation, even if any such claims may be caused by the negligence of those so released or held harmless. I acknowledge my responsibilities in participating in this event, for my decisions to start or continue to race in the event and to make certain that my boat, equipment and crew are seaworthy for the conditions which may be encountered during my participation I agree to abide by the Sailing Instructions of this regatta, the Rules of the US SAILING Association, the Racing Rules of Sailing and by the Rules of the Host Organization.
I understand that the publication of results and accounts of the competition, competitors and the yachts is a normal part of a regatta, as any sports competition, and authorize the Corinthian Yacht Club of Seattle to engage in such publicity with such information as may be provided in the course of the regatta, with the exception of personal contact information.
I further expressly agree that the foregoing release and waiver is intended to be as broad and inclusive as is permitted by law and that if any portion, clause or subclause hereof is held invalid, it is agreed that the balance shall, notwithstanding, continue in full force and legal effect. I HAVE CAREFULLY READ THIS AGREEMENT AND FULLY UNDERSTAND ITS CONTENTS. I AM AWARE THAT THIS IS A RELEASE OF LIABILITY AND WAIVER OF CLAIMS AND SIGN IT OF MY FREE WILL Received on Tue Apr 22 10:38:30 2003